So what would you do.....

[Malinda]

Someone asked me to make something....then it turned into 2 somethings. I said ok because it was a simple piece, I mean I cut both of the panels in one night, that simple. So I gave a price of course.....and as I worked on the first one I realized what a bargain my price is, I mean what the hell was I thinking? Now I can't very well go back and say "you know what, boy was I mistaken on the cost it's really going to cost you double the quote per panel". That's just bad business in my eyes. BUT do I really want to give these away? NO!

They did have another supplier of these panels in the US, I'm not even really sure why he asked me to do them this time instead of the regular person. One is finished and it's needed in a couple weeks. The second isn't needed until January. He's got time to get one from the person in the states...... My second one just needs grinding, foiling etc....a one session job to finish....like around 3 hours total left.

So...what would you do.....continue making the second one for the bargain price or ????? Note to self....this is the kind of crap that can happen when you want the money/business regardless of thinking everything through BEFORE answering.

[JoanFrances]

sounds like the person knew that you were way to low on your price and that is why they gave you the second one to do.  

You could deliver the first one and explain what happened and beg out of the second saying you are in the middle of getting ready to move and never did the research prior to giving the price for the second.  As long as they didn't pay you in advance for the second one, I don't see the harm.  I think it would be bad business to take the double lose now knowing what happened.  But it is a tough call.  

[Anne]

If the second panel is one that is fairly easily saleable I'd be keeping it Malinda and selling it to someone else.  Morally I'd feel I'd have to sell him the first one because I'd committed to doing it but you have a perfect excuse - because of the upcoming move - to just tell him it would be best if he got the second one from his other source. Then, finish the second one (or not- would it be easier in the move to bring it back in pieces?) then finish it and sell it later.

That's what I'd do anyway, I'm not into giving my work away - except to friends and family maybe.

[Glassic]

Wot Anne said.

[Kev]

And....it's not like your going to get repeat business from him, since your moving..so the only thing your going to lose is your money. Finish the first, and then be honest with him, that you underestimated the price and felt obligated to complete the first one for the agreed price, but cannot take a lose on a second one. Then it's in his ballpark to either ante up the price or get it elsewhere.

[Barbara]

I agree Kev and that is the truth and you won't feel like "you" got robbed

[ct4mom]

I agree with Kev, Malinda and if he really wants the 2nd piece he will understand and pay the difference, if not you have a panel to sell at a later time.

[Graham]

And....it's not like your going to get repeat business from him, since your moving..so the only thing your going to lose is your money. Finish the first, and then be honest with him, that you underestimated the price and felt obligated to complete the first one for the agreed price, but cannot take a lose on a second one. Then it's in his ballpark to either ante up the price or get it elsewhere.

That answer gets my vote!

[Lou Ann]

And....it's not like your going to get repeat business from him, since your moving..so the only thing your going to lose is your money. Finish the first, and then be honest with him, that you underestimated the price and felt obligated to complete the first one for the agreed price, but cannot take a lose on a second one. Then it's in his ballpark to either ante up the price or get it elsewhere.

That answer gets my vote!

mine too

and if he should cross your path again he will respect you for it and not have a bad taste in his mouth if you just bailed on the second one

[Wayne]

This is an interesting thread to say the least.

Were both panels ordered at the same time?

[Audrey]

I agree with what Kev said. Honesty is always a good policy.

[Elizabeth]

Aggree with Kev - I've under estimated many times and know how it feels!!  Honesty is the best approach - especially if he DID place the second order because your price was so low (and he was taking advantage???)
Beth

[Becki]

An estimate is one thing, a price quote another.  Once I've quoted a price I don't go back on it unless the customer changes the order in any way. If I'm not sure at the time of the request I ask if I can get back to them with a price after I work it up.  I know it hurts the pocketbook but sometimes, especially when it's our own mistake, we have to suck it up!

[Malinda]

thanks everyone...unfortunately he asked for the second panel straight away before I gave the price, so I can't consider him being cheeky lol. I just screwed up.

I've decided to just go ahead and finish the second one since it is already started and may not resell that easily (or at all). Hopefully when he get's them he will realize they are not only slightly larger than what he was used to getting BUT nicer and cost less so maybe he'll ask if that's really all I want for them? If he does then I'll be honest and see what he says to that.

Live and learn right...... :)

[Vic Rothman]

An estimate is one thing, a price quote another.  Once I've quoted a price I don't go back on it unless the customer changes the order in any way. If I'm not sure at the time of the request I ask if I can get back to them with a price after I work it up.  I know it hurts the pocketbook but sometimes, especially when it's our own mistake, we have to suck it up!

I  have to say that Becki has the ONLY professional answer. The only thing that separates a lot of people in this business is their word. You made a deal, bad as it may be, now you need to do what you committed to do. As Becki said, I ONLY change prices I quote when the customer changes the job, or the job drags on for years through no fault of mine.
Vic

[Malinda]

Thanks Vic, I am happy with my decission to press on and just learn from this. Regardless of anything I never want people to be justified in saying anything negative about me.

[Tom]

Malinda I think you made the best decision.  I agree with Vic.  People, rightly or wrongly will judge a person by how that person either did or did not live up to their word.  I know its hard to swallow sometimes, especially when it is going to cost you in one way or another, but I also believe you will have the right to take pride in the fact you stood up despite that cost and followed through with your commitment.  Circumstances can alter your ability to keep your original price, but if they are legitimate reasons, as Becki stated about a change in the order, or unreasonable time delays, or any other number of possibilities, then there should be no problem in changing the price quote.

[Becki]

This is an interesting thread to say the least.

I agree, Wayne.  Do you have any thoughts on the subject?

[Malinda]

All is good....delivered last night and he was happy with them, that's what's important to me :)

[Becki]

I'm glad it worked out for you, Mal, and that you're happy with the outcome.  I thought this was a good topic for discussion and would like to have heard from some of the others.

[JoanFrances]

I think that once Malinda made her decision on what to do, and Vic's rightful input, where wasn't anything left to say on the subject, except for remind the members when preparing to quote a price for a commissioned piece, to have time to do all the required research to ensure they can live with the price and deliver the finished piece as agreed on.         

[Becki]

I'm sorry, Joan Francis. I don't think that once Malinda had made her decision or Vic had responded that the discussion had to end. I found it an interesting topic with interesting responses. We seem to  sometimes avoid actual discussion here.  I think we can learn alot by how people respond to a topic such as this one...or maybe not.  No matter.

Malinda, I'm glad all worked out for you. 

[Malinda]

I think if people kept talking about it then people might feel like thier ethics would be getting into question. Nobody wants to be put on the spot like that :) We all have different thought patterns and while nobodies opinions/thoughts would ultimately change mine it was interesting to hear. I have to live with me and be happy with me :)

[Amber]

I think it was a really good question!

As an independent artist we sometimes have to strike our own balance and it's a learning curve from what I've seen so far *lol. I haven't been selling long but right from the get go I kept having to tell myself that I'm not Walmart, I'm not trying to be the lowest price and this is my home and my time needs to be respected if someone wants to come by and look at some pieces. That being said as an independent worker I need to take it upon myself to make sure I'm just as respectful and kind to anyone that wants to do business with me. If I had made a quote that later I felt was low I would still stick to it and just see it as lessons learned, the person was giving me business based on information that I relayed to them and to change it halfway through would just be disappointing to them. You can't let someone get attached to this lovely, handcrafted, personal gift as an idea and then come back and say it will cost more. Even if offering them a chance to bow out of the deal, it's still a low sinking feeling of disappointment for them and I would rather swallow the costs of doing a bad quote then have someone walk away from me like that.

I hope by tossing in my two cents no one was offended but I think Becki has a good idea by discussing these aspects of being a glass artists. This is a part of what we are and exactly the kinds of things that come up when we start out and even if it's not as fun as seeing some new artwork or looking over the nifty sheet of glass some picked up it's still important. And with this group of people being who they are, I feel safe that no one will throw stones as if this were a heated political debate *lol.

[Vic Rothman]

You know it's really  not much of a question. It's just do onto others..yad yada yada.

[Graham]

I'll go along with the do unto others thing.

Difference is, from the buying side, I would expect someone to make money. I wouldn't like to have them feel that I held them to an unreasonable deal. I would hope that they would tell me if they screwed up on the original quote. I wouldn't be this accomodating to a big corporation, but a little one man band is a different kettle of fish.

So, as the guy at the selling end of the deal, I would have no hesitation to go to the customer and reveal my error, and ask for relief. If the buyer did the "you made your bed, no sleep in it" thing, I'd take the loss. But I'd like to think that someone dealing with an inexperienced seller would be willing to dicker a little. The one time I had that happen, the customer softened somewhat, I kept the job, and he bought another panel the next season.

So, The words are the same, but Vic's "do unto others" translates a little differently than mine. It's a point of view thing.

[PiscesGlass]

Since the question of "what would you do" has been asked...

If you've accepted money as a downpayment on a quoted price..it's a done deal...legally...and the buyer can hold you accountable for providing that product at that price.  That's the legal aspect.  Now the moral issue is that Mal can always explain that due to whatever circumstances (the upcoming move, whatever else has been going on..that she gave a quote that was well thought out and is not fair to her.) and see what the guy says.  He might understand her plight and want to pay her a fair price for the work....or not...depending on the type of individual he is.

If I have underbid my work due to not thinking out my costs correctly..I usually sell it for the price I quoted the person.  LOL..also depends on "what" it is and whether or not it has sellability to another.

Of course the bigger issue is making sure that the pricing of ones work contains all the factors you need to make back your "costs".  Which involve, the space you do your work in, utilities costs, wear and tear of tools, glass, solder, flux, wire, chain, and your time, whether you are paying for delivery (in whatever manner) of said product and probably a miriad of items that I have neglected to add to the list. 

People get into making items to sell and have not thought about all of the hidden costs associated with producing these items and are simply happy to receive $$ for something that they've made.  The downsides of that is that they are making nothing on their product..and ultimately giving people the idea that people trying to make a fair income on their work are priced too high.

I'm hoping that no one takes offense..just stating my thoughts on the subject, with a slightly different slant.

De

[Elizabeth]

This has been a really interesting thread to follow!   I think it's good to hear other people's views on any subject.   As I said earlier - I have under-quoted from way back when in my pre-glass days when I did cake decorating,  but never amended my given price.!  Just sucked it up and vowed not to do it again.....
   These days,  unless I have previously made the item - I tend to say I will get back to the client with a price (which you then need to do QUICKLEY)!   But it does just give me time to collect my thoughts and not make snap decisions that I will live to regret!   (hopefully!)
But thanks for all the input anyway!
Beth